Damien

[Archived] Arms Warrior 5.4

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This thread is for comments about our Arms Warrior guide.

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Hi there,

Thanks for the guide

Anyway, I was wondering why you suggest Str gems instead critic's one ?

All simulation said Hit 7,5%>Exp 7,5%>Crit> Str

Thx

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I would like to point out that in the AoE section of this guide, it is said that when there are two targets the warrior should "keep sweeping strikes up and execute a single target rotation, replacing heroic strike with cleave". This appears to be incorrect because sweeping strikes will cause heroic strike to "cleave" regardless.

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Hi there,

Thanks for the guide

Anyway, I was wondering why you suggest Str gems instead critic's one ?

All simulation said Hit 7,5%>Exp 7,5%>Crit> Str

Thx

Thank you. We have updated the stat priority to reflect this. The changes should show up soon!

I would like to point out that in the AoE section of this guide, it is said that when there are two targets the warrior should "keep sweeping strikes up and execute a single target rotation, replacing heroic strike with cleave". This appears to be incorrect because sweeping strikes will cause heroic strike to "cleave" regardless.

Oops. You're right! Thanks very much for your comment!

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Hi Regarding the execute phase of the arms.

just to clarify. Does the priority shift to just Mortal Strike, Colossus Smash, and execute?

or do overpower and HS still have a place in there?

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How comes bladestorm should be used for single target purpose? Was it buffed? It was useless back in 4.3 am i wrong?

Seems odd.

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Hi Regarding the execute phase of the arms.

just to clarify. Does the priority shift to just Mortal Strike, Colossus Smash, and execute?

or do overpower and HS still have a place in there?

You are correct. That is what the rotation is supposed to be, essentially just Mortal Strike, Colossus Smash and Execute.

How comes bladestorm should be used for single target purpose? Was it buffed? It was useless back in 4.3 am i wrong?

Seems odd.

You make a good point. Bladestorm is DPS-neutral at this point (it's a tiny, tiny DPS loss) against a single target. I've updated the wording of the guide (both this one and the Fury one, where this is also the case). The updates should go up tomorrow morning :)

Sorry for the delayed responses, but rest assured everything is being read and taken into consideration.

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I found it , if you not get lucky on taste of blood , weave in a thunderclap for the deadzone damage

really not big fan of the new RNG arms, they got the LK ret problem now to be random, either they do very good damage due to many taste of blood proc or very low =(

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I found it , if you not get lucky on taste of blood , weave in a thunderclap for the deadzone damage

really not big fan of the new RNG arms, they got the LK ret problem now to be random, either they do very good damage due to many taste of blood proc or very low =(

Regarding Thunderclap, I think that since Rage is a finite resource, it's better to just wait for abilities to come back up after the deadzone and use rage on them instead. With my gear, Thunderclap deals less damage per rage than other abilities.

Let me know if I misunderstood you!

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I would like to point one thing i "discovered" (i guess i'm not the only one):

Dragon roar hit harder when you use it on a single target. Damage decrease as the number of target increase, for exemple:

1 target : 12k

2 targets: 10k

3 targets: 8k

(those are not accurate numbers)

I wanted to point that since i believe it greatly decrease its effectiveness and make bladestorm kinda usefull (or at least competitive) in AOE fight. (test have to be done to confirm that).

Sorry for my bad english.

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Update profession perks section for BS/JC/Skinning - becose you can use crit over strength there. Aswell as description below. Implying that crit>str is still true.

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I would like to point one thing i "discovered" (i guess i'm not the only one):

Dragon roar hit harder when you use it on a single target. Damage decrease as the number of target increase, for exemple:

1 target : 12k

2 targets: 10k

3 targets: 8k

(those are not accurate numbers)

I wanted to point that since i believe it greatly decrease its effectiveness and make bladestorm kinda usefull (or at least competitive) in AOE fight. (test have to be done to confirm that).

Sorry for my bad english.

I have not tried this out myself but it may hold true in larger groups of mobs. I have been using Dragon Roar exclusively since the patch and have done big damage to groups of two and three while doing dailies. The advantage of Dragon Roar is the aoe knockdown and the instant damage, allowing one to continue with other abilities while bladestorm's attack is over 6 seconds. I tried Dragon Roar for two reasons: To test a new ablility and Icy Veins said it was a good idea. I may try Bladestorm in a heroic before MoP goes live to check the numbers. Thanks for the input. I am always looking for a dps gain.

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I have not tried this out myself but it may hold true in larger groups of mobs. I have been using Dragon Roar exclusively since the patch and have done big damage to groups of two and three while doing dailies. The advantage of Dragon Roar is the aoe knockdown and the instant damage, allowing one to continue with other abilities while bladestorm's attack is over 6 seconds. I tried Dragon Roar for two reasons: To test a new ablility and Icy Veins said it was a good idea. I may try Bladestorm in a heroic before MoP goes live to check the numbers. Thanks for the input. I am always looking for a dps gain.

I do believe that it will be situational:

I you have to AOE for like 10 second bladestrom "should" perform better, if a big 2-3 sec aoe burst is needed then dragon roar should be way more effective.

PS: coupling bladestorm with bloodbath should give good results for sustained AOE.

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I've read the Arms and Fury guides of yours and I see that your explanation of when to use Berserker Rage is quite different (and maybe more emphasized) in the Fury guide. Should you not have the same kind of usage with Arms? Unless I missed something, the explanation seems quite simpler. Is it not best to use it for the best uptime of Enrage for both specializations?

Thanks

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I've read the Arms and Fury guides of yours and I see that your explanation of when to use Berserker Rage is quite different (and maybe more emphasized) in the Fury guide. Should you not have the same kind of usage with Arms? Unless I missed something, the explanation seems quite simpler. Is it not best to use it for the best uptime of Enrage for both specializations?

Thanks

You are right. This is my mistake. I developed the section greatly in the Fury guide, but forgot to mirror this in the Arms guide. It should be done now (or in a very short while). Thanks!

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Hi there,

Thanks for the guide

Anyway, I was wondering why you suggest Str gems instead critic's one ?

All simulation said Hit 7,5%>Exp 7,5%>Crit> Str

Thx

So if I am reading this right......Crit is before Str now??? Just asking your Warrior Arms guide does not reflect that change that please let me know. Thanks for the awesome guide

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I would like to point out that in the AoE section of this guide, it is said that when there are two targets the warrior should "keep sweeping strikes up and execute a single target rotation, replacing heroic strike with cleave". This appears to be incorrect because sweeping strikes will cause heroic strike to "cleave" regardless.

99% sure they take damage from both cleave and SS. At least that's what it shows in my scrolling combat text.

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So if I am reading this right......Crit is before Str now??? Just asking your Warrior Arms guide does not reflect that change that please let me know. Thanks for the awesome guide

Strength > Crit on a point for point basis. But keep in mind that gems give double the amount of secondary stats that they do primary ones, meaning that Strength needs to be more than twice as good as Crit for those gems to be preferable (which it isn't for Arms Warrior, although it's quite close).

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Out of curiosity, at what point does Fury overtake Arms, when it comes to Crit % ?

At low crit %, Arms is FAR ahead of Fury to say the least, simply because Fury does not get their enrage procs and thus spends a lot of time waiting for something to do (Enraging Blows)

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After seeing all your Mistakes you admitedly make post after post, (not just typo or forgot errors) I have come to the conclusion you have no clue. Someone who post a guide and then has to correct something everytime someone posts tells me you had no buisness writting one in the first place, or should have done your research. Also tells me you dont play this spec very often or at all.

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After seeing all your Mistakes you admitedly make post after post, (not just typo or forgot errors) I have come to the conclusion you have no clue. Someone who post a guide and then has to correct something everytime someone posts tells me you had no buisness writting one in the first place, or should have done your research. Also tells me you dont play this spec very often or at all.

Hey there!

I appreciate your feedback, but I feel you are being a bit unfair here.

  • There were no errors reported in this thread (or anywhere else regarding this guide) that had anything to do with the basics of playing the spec. In one case, I had overlooked to update a section of the Arms guide that I had updated (or rather, developed from the ground up) in the Fury guide. In a few other cases, the issues were related to the statistics priority or the relative value of DPS talents having changed. Note that these happened predominantly (even though using this word makes it sound like there were more occurrences than there actually were) around the times of the pre-Mists of Pandaria patch, and the Mists of Pandaria launch, both of which were times where a lot of information was changing very quickly.
  • You post in a manner that seems to imply that I've somehow wronged you or someone else by writing this guide. I haven't taken anyone's chance to write a better guide away. I haven't asked you, or anyone else, to pay money to read this guide. It is all free.
  • You jump to some conclusions that have the risk of being unfounded - and in this case are wrong. While my "skill" in playing Arms may be up for debate, it is certainly a spec that I am intimately familiar with.

Next time you post, I would appreciate it much more if you could offer some feedback about how to improve the guide, instead of making vague accusations from the cover of anonymity. Lastly, I take pride in "admittedly" recognizing mistakes that I make, because I see it as the best way to improve the content of this and other guides. Not much can be achieved if I sit here and consider myself in a position of high authority when reading feedback. After all, we are all just trying (hopefully) to improve the resource that we have so that anyone who wishes to learn more can do so with ease.

P.S.: Most of the things you refer to are the usual growing pains that a guide endures as it makes its way to a polished state. I think you will find that any guide worth its salt, on any website, undergoes many changes and updates, based on countless pages of comments. Moreover, these guides usually start in very basic (and incomplete) formats, where the author essentially waits for the community to fill the gaps. We at least put our own blood, sweat, and tears into writing the guides from scratch.

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A green trinket is probably better than SI:7 Operative's Manual [2/2], and yet you have this listed in the top...

Just for your information, upgrading both PvP trinkets will only net you in a loss of 1500 VPs since their stats are in no way changed.

I don't even understand how you had the guts to even post em.

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A green trinket is probably better than SI:7 Operative's Manual [2/2], and yet you have this listed in the top...

Just for your information, upgrading both PvP trinkets will only net you in a loss of 1500 VPs since their stats are in no way changed.

I don't even understand how you had the guts to even post em.

I don't really know what you're talking about. It's not listed "at the top" of anything that I can see. It's certainly not a recommended trinket in the BiS list. In the lists that list "all trinkets", it is listed according to item level. Please clarify.

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I don't really know what you're talking about. It's not listed "at the top" of anything that I can see. It's certainly not a recommended trinket in the BiS list. In the lists that list "all trinkets", it is listed according to item level. Please clarify.

Yes it is in the gearing up section of trinkets.

IMO any PvP trinket with no stats other than PvPpower/Resi, has absolutely no relevance to a gearing up list. An Int trinket will probably be more useful (and you don't list it).

What really ticked me though, is that fact that it was listed with both upgrades, which in this case (for the 2 new PvP trinkets) the upgrade does absolutely nothing. So that will only incur a 1500 VP loss to any person who's not that much into the game.

All of this could be confusing to some new players of which many look up for the guides posted on IV.

Don't get me wrong, I find IV quite good, and although it might not be the top reference for hardcore players and theorycrafters, it really does help new people start somewhere, and my comment was just made to avoid confusion for these exact 'newbies'.

You wouldn't want to have a guy equip one of those, and go boast that 'Yeah I read on IV that it was on the recommended trinket list!'

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Yes it is in the gearing up section of trinkets.

IMO any PvP trinket with no stats other than PvPpower/Resi, has absolutely no relevance to a gearing up list. An Int trinket will probably be more useful (and you don't list it).

What really ticked me though, is that fact that it was listed with both upgrades, which in this case (for the 2 new PvP trinkets) the upgrade does absolutely nothing. So that will only incur a 1500 VP loss to any person who's not that much into the game.

All of this could be confusing to some new players of which many look up for the guides posted on IV.

Don't get me wrong, I find IV quite good, and although it might not be the top reference for hardcore players and theorycrafters, it really does help new people start somewhere, and my comment was just made to avoid confusion for these exact 'newbies'.

You wouldn't want to have a guy equip one of those, and go boast that 'Yeah I read on IV that it was on the recommended trinket list!'

Ok, that makes a lot of sense! We're removing these trinkets right now :)

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      10. Unbreakable Steel

      Once you complete this path, you will receive a quest that will start a small series to empower your weapon. It will start with the quest The Broken Shore: Investigating the Legion in which you will need to find a randomly-dropped item: Mysterious Runebound Scroll. Once you find this item you will begin a short quest chain:
      1. Arms: The Thieving Apprentice
      2. Professionally Good Looking
      3. Order of Incantations (The order is Arcane -> Frost -> Fire -> Shadow)
      4. The Archmage Accosted
      Once you complete these, you'll be asked to go back to Dalaran and receive the power from the Council of Six. Strom'kar will empower and you will have access to the new traits.
      Important Note: The following path can be simplified, for general purposes, as such: Get the new golden trait (Executioner's Precision). Once that's done you can chose whatever talents in the weapon you wish. The differences in numbers are literally so close and variable based on your personal character there is no 100% definitive path to take. If you're looking for definitive choices, you can sim your warrior to find the best results.
      If you're looking for a direction to take because you do not want to sim yourself or whatever reason, you can take the following path. The steps that have multiple choice is, again, a choice completely up to you. Just make sure all choices are filled before you move to the next step.
       


      1. Executioner's Precision
      Arms of the Valarjar Storm of Swords Soul of the Slaughter Executioner's Precision 2. Exploit the Weakness
      3. Deathblow / Crushing Blows / Precise Strikes
      4. One Against Many / Unending Rage / Many Will Fall
      5. Touch of Zakajz / Tactical Advance
      Once you have these traits filled in, the last trait will become available. It has 50 points to dropped into it and it's my belief that Blizzard does not want us to cap it out this expansion. According to the Wowhead Calculator it would take a total of 865,842,644,766,330 Artifact Power to fill 100%.
       
       

      The only addon that I really deem significant is Weak Auras. You can use it to track literally everything in the game if it's trackable. Use this for boss encounters and, more specifically, monitoring your buffs / debuffs for your Arms Warrior. Important things to track include, but are not limited to:
      Shattered Defenses Colossus Smash Executioner's Precision Rend Battle Cry Potion of the Old War ____________________________________________
      Change Log:
      7/17/2016: Original Post
      7/19/2016: Updated Post to reflect similarities in IV's Guide on Talents and Stat weights where needed.
      7/31/2016: Updated for recent simulation results in talent choices and stat priority. Also updated Addons.
      8/27/2016: Added Artifact path information.
      9/4/2016: Updated Stat Priorities, Rotation, Artifact Path, and Macros.
      9/18/20126: Updated Links of Interest, Stat Priorities, & Rotation Priority sections.
      9/27/2016: Updated FAQ and Macros sections.
      10/26/2016: Updated Macros section.
      12/08/2016: FAQ, Talents, Rotation, Macro sections updated.
      3/30/2017: Artifact Path updated for 7.2 changes.
      6/15/2017: Talents, Stats, & Rotation sections updated due to 7.2.5 changes to the Arms specialization.
      8/2/2017: Talents & Rotation sections updated to Rend Build. Included Fight Specific Talent choices. Addons updated. Removed Macros section.
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    • By Graghzug
      Sorry if this has been asked before, but search didn't give me any results.  With the advent of Argus, I have been getting more gear with higher item levels than my normal/heroic T20 gear.  The basic question is, as an arms warrior when do I swap out my gear and lose the 4 piece set bonus for higher item level gear?  Thanks in advance for any help.