Kazowee

Assassination Rogue Help for Garrosh and more

13 posts in this topic

I have an assassination rogue that I believe is not living up to his potential.  Here is the toon link: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/fizzcrank/KnotMeiFault/advanced.

 

Here a a WOL link http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/60gzlfj81z6wu6gf/ to a recent fight.  My concern is the drastic difference between Siegecrafter Blackfuse results and Garrosh results.

 

Note that he did not have Hellscream's Razor until after the fight.  His MH was the same as his OH (Hvitserk's Formidable Shanker) and he was gemmed/reforged per Mr. Robot's default 5.4 stat priority.

 

Here are my questions:

1) Are there any "low hanging fruit" to improve DPS on the Garrosh fight (not just Garrosh himself)?

2) Other suggestions?

3) How do you make your observations RE #1 and #2?  I'm new to WOL, and am learning how to extract useful information.

 

Thanks for your help,

    Kazowee

Edited by Kazowee
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I may be incorrect but I believe with assassination rogues your primary secondary stat is mastery. If you look at your logs your poison is your highest damaging aspect. I would regem and forge for maximum mastery to increase the damage of your poisons. 

 

Beyond that if you are doing mechanics correctly I would expect lower dps per say on garrosh. After phase 1, adds and mc'd allies are the highest priorities to nuke down. This is all down time on garrosh. With your main source of damage more or less being a dot, it has time to drop of garrosh and doesn't have enough time on adds to do a ton of damage. 

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I'll get back to you in the next couple days, unfortunately I don't have time to do a log analysis tonight. Stand by.

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What's most important is his knowing how to use Assassination based on adds out.

 

For example, in Phase 1 Garrosh, he should be trying to get an Envenom 5 CP right as the adds stack on the boss, then spam Fan of Knives so they have a better poisoning chance. For the Wolfrider part of the phase, he should be switching, Rupturing it (at the least, if not burning it) and then back to Garrosh. 

 

For Phase 2, he should be doing just fine with single target, as long as he has his Rupture and Slice and Dice up. Be aware DPS may fall from switching to MCs.

 

Is he properly refreshing SnD with as little CPs as possible (1 is best, as Envenom maxes it upon hit)?

Is he trying to keep Envenom buff up as much as possible during AoE situations?

Is he using Vanish regularly for the extra (almost free) CPs?

Is he using the Glyph of Redirect to minimize detriment from switching targets?

 

Just my input based on his armory. I wasn't able to examine the logs at this time.

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One thing I noticed is that he took around 20 seconds to get slice and dice up, which is very bad, it should be up much quicker.

I'm not as good with WoL as WCL so I can't say too much, but try to get him to pool some energy and cp for when the adds come out, then envenom and spam fok a few times to get poisons up on all of them.

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Also I would personally recommend him to play with mastery>crit>haste most of the time , not haste>crit>mastery as he currently has.

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Rupture uptime on Garrosh, unless I am misreading this, was 80% so that has to be up around 93% and higher if it's possible.

I am a mastery, haste, crit build currently and am MUCH more confident with it.

A Haste build does not take into account human error, with those haste builds at higher levels you can't make hardly any button mashing mistakes without losing butt tons of dps, then again we are all different players, that's just been my experience.

There is also a theory where crit rules over haste and master at your ilvl area, I believe mr robot gives the crit build priority at higher levels.

 

Krush is super with logs, he'll give you some good solid answers that I know I cannot. Good luck man

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Alright, let's take a look at this. Sorry for the delay, it's been a really busy week at work and I haven't had a moment to spare.

 

 

Garrosh Hellscream

 

Slice and Dice: There's a larger than average chunk of time at the beginning of the fight where the buff is not active. The opening sequence looks good (Rupture up, then SnD, then Envenom). Maybe he was far away from the boss at the start or AFK for a few seconds? It could be just the logs fooling my eyes too.

 

Rupture: It looks like he had some troubles early in the fight with Rupture. Part of the gaps are likely due to the phase transition, but even including those, Rupture should be a high priority even on adds. Venomous Wounds will refund your energy from a Rupture on a dying target, so you don't lose much in the transaction.

 

Vendetta: Used 4 times with even spacing between casts with the first cast on the opening. Looks good.

 

Shadow Blades: Used 2 times. Looks like he got a bit unlucky in not having the third cast quite ready for the ending. Looks good

 

Blindside/Dispatch: There were more than a few times where the Blindside buff was up for more than the split section it should be up. I have posted a macro in various topics to fix this problem, but I'll post it again at the end.

 

Envenom: 117s of uptime versus the maximum potential of 150s. This means there was either some extra buff clipping going on or there were non-5 point Envenoms being cast. Tracking and exploiting this buff needs to be more of a priority.

 

Defensives: Feint being cast only 5 times on a fight like Garrosh is brutally low. There are a number of sources of AoE damage that should be mitigated for the success of the raid. Cloak of Shadows being cast only 4 times is too low for the same reason.

 

Oddities: No strange spells being cast or attacks being used, looks good.

 

Overall: There are some things to fix, but I don't see a glaring problem on this fight DPS wise. I'd like to see a lot more focus on defensive abilities though, as that is a major contribution a rogue can bring to a raid. A rogue can easily be at the bottom of the damage taken meters on pretty much any encounter.

 

Here is the Dispatch macro that will simplify the Blindside/35% problem:

 

#showtooltip Dispatch
/startattack
/castsequence reset=0.2 1, Mutilate;
/castsequence reset=0.2 Dispatch;
 
As long as he is spamming that key as his combo point builder (and what rogue doesn't) this macro will work beautifully. Just put it in place of Mutilate and remove Dispatch from the action bar.
 
 
Siegecrafter Blackfuse
 
Before I analyze, I'll make a distinction between this fight and Garrosh when I first look at the log. Garrosh is a target switching fight with phase transitions and running between targets, whereas Siegecrafter is a stand-and-stab where your rogue has 100% uptime on one target. This alone will make a large difference in the end result. This also means you can be much more critical of less than perfect play.
 
Slice and Dice: Perfect.
 
Rupture: Almost perfect. Two short blips of non-activity, but nothing that would seriously affect performance.
 
Vendetta: Perfect. Got unlucky that the fight ended as the third cast just started.
 
Shadow Blades: Almost perfect. Probably could have started that second cast earlier to have it up longer for the end of the fight.
 
Blindside/Dispatch: Same sort of problem as Garrosh, the buff is up for too long. That macro looks like it will be quite helpful.
 
Envenom: 138s out of a maximum potential 180s. Same note as last time, he's either clipping or casting non-5 second Envenoms. Focusing on this buff will move him to the next level of play.
 
Defensives: Zero Feint, zero Cloak of Shadows! You're killing me, man!
 
Oddities: No strange spells or attacks being used.
 
Overall: Defensive abilities ya goober! Use that Dispatch macro and start to focus on the Envenom buff, because your uninterrupted DPS rotation is pretty much perfect otherwise.
 
 
I think I've covered your first two questions throughout this analysis. As for your third question, the method I use to analyze logs is outlined here: http://www.icy-veins.com/forums/topic/5368-diy-rogue-evaluation-guide/ . You need to know a bit about the ins and outs of your website of choice to get a good read on logs, so if you have any functional questions about how to obtain the information you want through the DIY Guide I would be happy to answer them over in that thread.
 
Again, sorry for the delay, hope this helps!

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How important is it to use blindside asap? I thought as long as you didn't cap or use mutilate while it was up its fine. Maybe I just have low energy regen at the moment to have to worry that much. 

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It's true that the only test for the Blindside buff is making sure you don't use Mutilate when you have it, as it may overwrite the current buff. There may be a situation in a fight where you get the Blindside buff and using a finishing move before casting Dispatch, but that comes up fairly infrequently in my experience. I would be very surprised looking at the log provided that there were over 5 instances in a 3 minute fight where it was ineffective to cast a zero energy Dispatch immediately.

 

Fortunately, the macro I posted handles this situation as well. It is not possible to cast Mutilate before Dispatch while you have the Blindside buff when you use the macro, so if you do end up having to use a finishing move right after gaining the buff, you don't have to worry about wasting the buff.

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What's most important is his knowing how to use Assassination based on adds out.

 

For example, in Phase 1 Garrosh, he should be trying to get an Envenom 5 CP right as the adds stack on the boss, then spam Fan of Knives so they have a better poisoning chance. For the Wolfrider part of the phase, he should be switching, Rupturing it (at the least, if not burning it) and then back to Garrosh. 

 

For Phase 2, he should be doing just fine with single target, as long as he has his Rupture and Slice and Dice up. Be aware DPS may fall from switching to MCs.

 

Is he properly refreshing SnD with as little CPs as possible (1 is best, as Envenom maxes it upon hit)?

Is he trying to keep Envenom buff up as much as possible during AoE situations?

Is he using Vanish regularly for the extra (almost free) CPs?

Is he using the Glyph of Redirect to minimize detriment from switching targets?

 

Just my input based on his armory. I wasn't able to examine the logs at this time.

Whew - there is a lot of stuff in here.

1) If I understand you correctly, the envenom does direct damage based on the CP, and then there is a period of increased probability of applying poisons.  The length of this time depends on CP.  Is this correct?

2) For wolfriders, why would I not burn it?

3) Other questions are good reminders (and no, I wasn't using redirect, but it is now on my action bar).

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Alright, let's take a look at this. Sorry for the delay, it's been a really busy week at work and I haven't had a moment to spare.

 

 

Garrosh Hellscream

 

[Extensive analysis removed for brevity]

 
I think I've covered your first two questions throughout this analysis. As for your third question, the method I use to analyze logs is outlined here: http://www.icy-veins.com/forums/topic/5368-diy-rogue-evaluation-guide/ . You need to know a bit about the ins and outs of your website of choice to get a good read on logs, so if you have any functional questions about how to obtain the information you want through the DIY Guide I would be happy to answer them over in that thread.
 
Again, sorry for the delay, hope this helps!

 

 

for ( ; ; ) Thanks();  // Nerd C code for saying thanks a lot

 

You gave me some specific low-hanging fruit (envenom, for example).  You included the link to your DIY guide (I hadn't come across it yet, haven't been following the forums closely until this ceiling became an issue).  And you pricked my conscience regarding defensives.

 

I've joined Goobers Anonymous, and am taking the next steps to goober sobriety.

 

Thanks very much for your time and help.

Edited by Kazowee

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Whew - there is a lot of stuff in here.

1) If I understand you correctly, the envenom does direct damage based on the CP, and then there is a period of increased probability of applying poisons.  The length of this time depends on CP.  Is this correct?

2) For wolfriders, why would I not burn it?

3) Other questions are good reminders (and no, I wasn't using redirect, but it is now on my action bar).

 

1. Yes you've got it right.

2. If the rogue is going to be primarily responsible for interrupting/killing the wolfrider, then yes, stay on it until it dies. If someone else is primarily responsible, getting a Rupture on the target will be a helpful contribution.

 

 

I'll be updating the guide for 6.0 and beyond as abilities are added and priorities change.

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