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Guest SerbComando

Hi, i think windrunner is much more than "mobility overkill". This talent is not about escaping "overkill" in my opinion.

If you have healer and good team composition, this talent makes sylvanas very agresive hero - a lot of times I use that talent for fast reloading (have 3 burst damage instead of 1!). Whith that talent she can do merc alone very fast, kill boss and imortal very fast, use her burst damage 3 times instead of one, even chase running heroes (you can tell one teleport is enough, but again it is not all about reaching hero, its about fast reload).

I dont say it is recomened talent, but definitly situatiinal - that talent makes sylvanas power "limitless", and her plays "sick", but you need skill to use maximum of that talent, and of course - it is situational.

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Guest Guest

 

 

 

Lastly, I can see your reasons for lvl 13 talent choices.. Though I personally still would much rather Will of the Forsaken with mind control to try to stop a potential stun or even outplay an Illidan hunt.

 

 

 

Will of the Forsaken is terrible in my opinion. A 60-second cooldown on a talent that has virtually no use while out of team fight. Will of the Forsaken is an escape-overkill, as one Haunting Wave should be enough to get you to safety. Furthermore, careful positioning before casting Mind Control makes Will of the Forsaken redundant. 

 

Last but not least, Overwhelming Affliction is fantastic if used with Mind Control. If the mind-controlled survives the duration of Mind Control, you can immediately slow it tremendously while it is still surround by your allies. 

 

 

Hi Kendric!

 

I must say, great guide, and overall I really like your review of the revamped Sylvanas talents! The only thing I would like to add is on 13) Windrunner. I think you fail to realize the burst potential you get with the refill on Withering Fire. Especially with Withering Barrage at lvl 4. The synergy with other Withering Fire talents and/or Black Arrow talents (Unstable Poison, Remorseless and what not) you can do some crazy damage. 

 

Also in terms of mobility I think you give it too little credit, as you stated on the ability description of Haunting Wave, one of it's downsides is it's long cooldown, with that you can kinda view Windrunner as a 5 second cooldown reduction on Haunting Wave, considering that it's cooldown starts ticking regardless of the second cast or not down to 6 from 11 seconds.

 

I guess what I'm saying is, don't underrestimate overkill mobility, Windrunner is alot better than it was pre-patch! smile.png

 

Thanks for the guide!

Regards, legobil

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Thanks a lot for your input, legobil! 

 

I will observe the pro teams and experiment with Windrunner myself a bit. Who knows, maybe we'll change our mind. smile.png

 

Stay awesome! 

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Guest Kallest

The reason i personally pick up Paralsis is too stun both towers or the base and the tower, so my team can take bases without minions to soak the damage.

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On 12/18/2016 at 11:17 PM, Guest Kallest said:

The reason i personally pick up Paralsis is too stun both towers or the base and the tower, so my team can take bases without minions to soak the damage.

I do that too, actually.

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Not sure where I read this, but ParalysisParalysis is going to be removed in coming patches, replaced by a 7 second stun on Haunting WaveHaunting Wave for minions and mercs. Just a heads up!

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7 hours ago, Niteshadow said:

Not sure where I read this, but ParalysisParalysis is going to be removed in coming patches, replaced by a 7 second stun on Haunting WaveHaunting Wave for minions and mercs. Just a heads up!

I'm updating her later today. Big guide rehaul, including new recommendations. Stay tuned.

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Guest SgtBaker

I get you don't need the second cast of Haunting Wave, but what about the refill of Withering Fire? How can you go past 15 shots instead of five? Doesn't that drastically reduce your damage output? What am I missing?

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On 1/6/2017 at 10:32 PM, Guest SgtBaker said:

I get you don't need the second cast of Haunting Wave, but what about the refill of Withering Fire? How can you go past 15 shots instead of five? Doesn't that drastically reduce your damage output? What am I missing?

The updated version of the guide recommends Windrunner. I'm not sure why Srey didn't, to be quite honest.

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56 minutes ago, Constantine said:

The old builds prior to yesterday were better than this new build.

Better, worse, good, bad, love, hate. These are empty suggestive words I cannot use as legitimate criticism because you omitted, willingly or not, to provide a useful context. The talent section of the guide provides situational alternatives to this build anyway, which more or less moots your statement.

What is objectively true, however, is that some of the talents that were listed yesterday don't even exist anymore. Let that sink in for a moment and try and understand how that might affect your perspective.

Another objective fact: the suggested build is relatively well supported by data as a factor of effectiveness and popularity. Unfortunately, Sylvanas is currently a bit out of meta, making it difficult to obtain a reasonable sample size - hence my use of "relatively well supported". We also haven't even had a week to get data for the newer talents. Fortunately for you, Icy Veins generally hires strong players with strong ties to professional players, for discussion purposes, to take some of the guesswork out of this equation.

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Guest Push with immortal?

Hello, I was wondering on Battlefield of Eternity if its better to push with the immortal or split push. I can see pros and cons of doing either but would like to get some expert advice. Thanks in advance. 

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On 2/25/2017 at 5:04 AM, Guest Push with immortal? said:

Hello, I was wondering on Battlefield of Eternity if its better to push with the immortal or split push. I can see pros and cons of doing either but would like to get some expert advice. Thanks in advance. 

I am not a pro player, by far, but answering your question: it always depends on the specific circumstances. You should be quick to judge the current situation regarding split pushing or not:

- Pay attention to the mini-map. If you can spot the entire enemy team trying to contain your team's Immortal, it might be good to split push instead so you can soak some extra XP and tower damage without being harassed. But make sure you retreat if you notice some unusual movement in the enemy team, because if they see you by yourself taking a tower they WILL retaliate.

- Split pushing alone while your team is going with the Immortal can easily result in overextending if you're careless. Make sure that you got it covered in case there are fast Assassins in opposing team that can take you down.

- I say that if the situation is favorable (I.e. half of the opposing team is dead), than the best thing to do is split push, having a team of 3 going with the Immortal and 2 in the other lane (those two being Sylvanas and someone else). Coordination is key.

- You can also bait the enemy team into chasing you split pushing since you will have no extra damage from the Immortal. If you're smart and fast enough you can force the enemy team into desperately going to the lane you are, making them waste time.

Edited by Valhalen
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Guest ShimmyJimmy

Hey, though I am not a pro-player, Sylvanas is my most played Specialist (most of my main Heroes are specialists, though I do all 4 roles) and I wanted to share some input with you guys on a couple of un-recommended talents.

At Lvl 4, With the Wind can make Sylvanas so much harder to kill and allows her to poke Heroes from a considerable distance. Against Tracer I think this talent is absolutely mandatory, as it allows Sylvanas to bring Tracer's health to half from a safe distance just by pressing Q. This makes Sylvanas a Raynor to Tracer, forcing Tracer to keep her distance from your entire team (after a few failed dive-ins). The damage you sacrifice by not taking Lost Soul is significant, but if the enemy team knows how to avoid spreading Shadow Dagger (difficult to tell by LvL 4, no major team-fights yet) then With the Wind is a safer choice. Later in the game at lvl 16, this will greatly increase Sylvanas' survivability by applying the slow or speed buff from a longer distance.

At LvL 7, though I prefer Barbed Shot 90% of the time, Possession does have it's uses, especially when paired with lane pushers such as Asmodan who benefit greatly from large minion waves. But what I find the most egregious is the fact that this guide does not mention that Possession can take control of enemy catapults (can be a game saver if you turn 3 catapults at once near your core)! I know this would not warrant taking the talent on its own, but you should mention it at least so that people can make an educated choice.

Lvl 16 Look, I know writing articles takes up time and money, but I think the plethora of game-changing talents Sylvanas gets at lvl 16 should not be reduced to a discussion about Cold Embrace. Bot Overwhelming Affliction and Evasive Fire can turn the game around - suddenly Sylvanas can no longer be chased, and if the enemy team got in the habit of doing so until lvl 16 they are in for a surprise, especially when paired with With the Wind at lvl 4. I am aware that Cold Embrace helps your entire team more and this is a team game etc. etc., but the other two talents are definitely worth discussing. Remorseless can do wonders on Battlefield of Eternity, but it is a very situational talent.

Also, as a general side note, Sylvanas is a horrible Mercenary Camper. She can clear enemy Mercs in lane or help your own Mercs pushing, but before lvl 13 it takes ages for Sylvanas to take a Merc camp (even with Barbed Shot). Even if she will emerge with full HP after taking the camp, the time she spends taking the camp would be better used sieging enemy fortifications or clearing lanes. Every allied minion is a mercenary when enemy towers are stunned by Black Arrow. She is the same as Xul in that regard.

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31 minutes ago, Guest best sylvanas eune said:

This guide is -

Edited your comment since the profanity wasn't necessary and the rest of the comment wasn't in English. Feel free to add some proper feedback rather than just saying something is bad with nothing else to back it up.

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Guest Axolot

I just found what seems to be an error. In the guide it says in the level 13 : https://www.icy-veins.com/heroes/sylvanas-talents#level-13

Quote

Will of the Forsaken Icon Will of the Forsaken is essentially a better self-Cleanse Icon Cleanse with twice the Cooldown and some built-in mobility. 

Both actually have the same cooldown. Will of the forsaken duration is 3 time higher but cooldown is the same

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3 hours ago, Guest Axolot said:

I just found what seems to be an error. In the guide it says in the level 13 : https://www.icy-veins.com/heroes/sylvanas-talents#level-13

Both actually have the same cooldown. Will of the forsaken duration is 3 time higher but cooldown is the same

Thanks for pointing this out. We are trying to get a new system of error-checking to work, but it will take some time, so until then, sorry for the discrepancies in guides, and thanks again for pointing those out!

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Guest Sylv enthusiatic

When I decide to quit HoTs, i will make a guide which will make sylvanas S+ Tier :)
 

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I must say that I particularly loved the rework they did on Sylvanas. Since they are eliminating the Specialist role very soon, making her into a full-Assassin is the way to go. I am particularly fond of the Shadow Dagger build, which is brutally powerful in the endgame if played correctly.

Here is my talent-per-talent dissection:

Quote

 

Level 1: Unfurling ShadowsUnfurling Shadows

This is the core of her entire build. While 0.5% damage increase may seem low, it is incredibly easy to stack, as you'll gain stacks per tick of her Shadow DaggerShadow Dagger damage-over-time. In the endgame she can reach almost Lunara-levels of damage-over-time. This talent has NO CAP (I've managed to stack over 300 in a single match).

The general idea is to hit an enemy three times with Basic Attacks and then latch the dagger on them for easy stacks.

Focus your stacking on whatever Hero is closer, so mostly tanks. The idea is to always stack this quest whenever you can.

 

Level 4: Unstable PoisonUnstable Poison

This talent increases her general waveclear power as it procs from basic attacks, allowing you to save your Shadow DaggerShadow Dagger for enemy Heroes and get stacks for Unfurling ShadowsUnfurling Shadows.

 

Level 7: Lost SoulLost Soul 

This one has fantastic synergy with Unfurling ShadowsUnfurling Shadows, as you'll be focusing a target with basic attacks to keep those 3 Stacks of Banshee Curse so you can generate more stacks of Unfurling Shadows, and by attacking this very same target you'll be reducing the cooldown of your Shadow DaggerShadow Dagger to get even more stacks of Unfurling Shad- you see where I'm getting at here?

 

Level 10: Any

Either Heroic works fine. Doesn't really matter. Mind ControlMind Control is harder to land now, and not as powerful as before, although it has a much lower cooldown. I personally prefer Wailing ArrowWailing Arrow due its range and silence effect.

 

Level 13: RemorselessRemorseless

You might think "Why didn't you pick Cold EmbraceCold Embrace instead to synergize with her other Shadow DaggerShadow Dagger talents?", and the answer is that the extra range on her basic attacks plus untalented Withering FireWithering Fire will greatly aid her DPS, as well help maintain the the Banshee Curse debuff. So more basic attacks equals to more Unfurling ShadowsUnfurling Shadows stacks, which equals to more damage.

 

Level 16: Life DrainLife Drain

Oh boy, this is where Sylvanas becomes completely broken, with a self-sustain that can put Mal'ganis and Illidan to shame. This talent affects ALL of her damage, meaning she will get heals from:

  • Basic Attacks, and remember she deals more damage thanks to Banshee's Curse;
  • All the arrows from Withering FireWithering Fire (including the free shot from RemorselessRemorseless);
  • The damage-over-time from Shadow DaggerShadow Dagger (which by the time you get this talent you should have at least 150 stacks);
  • Haunting WaveHaunting Wave;
  • Wailing ArrowWailing Arrow.

Oh, and did I say this self-heals procs from anything? Minions, mercenaries, structures. And doubled on Heroes. It is ridiculous.

 

Level 20: Withering BarrageWithering Barrage

Pretty self-explanatory. More barrages equals to more damage!

However, if you don't feel confidend enough or is facing a dive-oriented composition, then Bolt of the StormBolt of the Storm, I guess.

 

Have fun until she is nerfed!

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Guest No Update

The frontpage says that Sylvanas and Stitches have new guides for their reworks but this is still the old one.

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1 hour ago, Brutalis said:

Her new playstyle is insanely dull.

Wel... Her old playstyle was way more dull. All you had to to was sit on lanes and Basic Attack the Structures.

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12 hours ago, Valhalen said:

Wel... Her old playstyle was way more dull. All you had to to was sit on lanes and Basic Attack the Structures.

Respectfully, I disagree. Personally I really enjoy the PvE heroes in mobas. Splitpushing is one of my favourite things to do and there are so many nuances to it, more so in HOTS than other mobas because of the different maps. Knowing when to take mercs to set up a push while you push elsewhere or join the team for a fight takes a lot of knowledge and experience. Choosing when to show up at an objective or to push, knowing when to split rather than pushing as 5 etc etc.

The whole “sit in one lane doing nothing but pushing mindlessly” thing people always did with Sylv was the wrong way to play her. And now she’s just a generic ranged assassin that can help your team push after winning an objective or fight.

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