5.4 Destruction Tips and Quirks

[Lockybalboa 618]

Hello have a fast question.

Is it worth snapshotting imolate with your major DPS cooldown? (the one that gives 30% Crit Chance).

As said recently boosted my warlock and trying to get the hang of it

Is this a good practise? Or should I only reserve it for when there is no time to cast CB during the last few seconds

Cheers

Berlinia

 

 

Trinkets are better (normally) but DS is good enough to dump with also.

 

PBI has a 115 second ICD, DS is 120 seconds. So *normally* the two will line up very nicely, sometimes the RNG gods feel like picking on you and slap you around a bit. In that case, PBI is what I focus my dump on, but I would also dump as much as possible with the DS too.

[Jayros 0]

Hello, 

 

I have been seeing a bit of warlocks start reforging more into haste or crt. I was wondering if haste is greater then crt now somehow. I know you need to be careful with haste since with +5% raid buff, and bloodlust you will be casting faster then your 1 second GC. Also most of their secondary spec's are Afflic, that might have something to do with it. Was just wondering what your guys thoughts are. 

 

Thanks

[Lockybalboa 618]

Hello, 

 

I have been seeing a bit of warlocks start reforging more into haste or crt. I was wondering if haste is greater then crt now somehow. I know you need to be careful with haste since with +5% raid buff, and bloodlust you will be casting faster then your 1 second GC. Also most of their secondary spec's are Afflic, that might have something to do with it. Was just wondering what your guys thoughts are. 

 

Thanks

 

 

 

Haste and crit are even in value till about 11-12k haste, past that makes for to much GCD capping issues and so loses it's value.

 

Until that 11-12k mark, haste and crit are even in terms of damage gain. It comes down to play style.

[Jayros 0]

Ok thank you

[Soulzar 42]

To further that, one of the main benefits and why I ultimately switched from crit is because haste over crit works better for Affliction/Demo offspecs without any impact on Destro.

[AstanoVidatu 4]

Ok, so I have gone through Mr robot and tested both of it's pve builds, crit over haste and haste over crit and  either way it still feels like my spellcasts are taking forever, and not even hitting hard enough to justify the lengthy cast times. 

 

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/feathermoon/Ebonscourge/simple

 

these are the gems it just recommended I put in instead of the pure intel and haste gems I had. 

I am only getting about 150k dps single target unless my procs line up really well.  And I know that's really low for the ilvl and gear I have. 

Any suggestions demon experts?

[Stunlocked 8]

Read the stickies, esp. the fixing your DPS FAQ. If you want more in depth analysis! the regulars are going to ask to post your logs.

[Desos 18]

Ok, so I have gone through Mr robot and tested both of it's pve builds, crit over haste and haste over crit and  either way it still feels like my spellcasts are taking forever, and not even hitting hard enough to justify the lengthy cast times. 

 

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/feathermoon/Ebonscourge/simple

 

these are the gems it just recommended I put in instead of the pure intel and haste gems I had. 

I am only getting about 150k dps single target unless my procs line up really well.  And I know that's really low for the ilvl and gear I have. 

Any suggestions demon experts?

 

It´s been a while since you´ve posted, but could you log out in destruction specc and gear? And then, since Stunlocked mentioned it and many others will mention it, post logs. Gear will eventually come but if you want to get better at playstyle, log yourself and let somebody look through it.

[Nytemare 2]

So with WoD coming up and passive perk each spec get, Destro bring Crit over Mastery (which is strangle) I been thinking of race changing from Human to Worgen for 1% crit bonus.

 

Every 1% crit  = 1% CB damage right?

 

I was thinking of dropping enchanting for either Skiining / Herb

 

Skinning as if above is true 1% crit = 1% CB damage, then crit bonus from skinning  (.80) should be good right? not fully percent, but getting .20 should be easy to official get another 1% damage

 

Herb was because I read places that Herb seems to be good for classes that can line it up. 2min Cd lines perfect with DSI, also read on IcyVeins that "At Heroic gear level (RPPM trinkets and Legendary meta gem), Herbalism and Engineering become your professions of choice." So is Herb really that good? I am currently 5/14H (Immer, FP, Nour, Sha, Gal)

 

So what do you guys think would be better does destro?

[Liquidsteel 279]

Herbalism is for Demo/Afflic. It's not a good profession for Destro.

Skinning is crap because it gives nothing compared to what any of the crafting professions grant you. A bit of crit rating is far worse than an extra 2k intellect proc, for example.

Also dwarf looks set to be the best alliance race in WoD.

[Zagam 1,983]

And Blood Elves for Horde -_-

 

Also, while yes, 1% crit = 1% CB damage, 1% Mastery does the same and requires less rating, so Crit will not outweigh Mastery.  As for WoD, we're unsure of official ratings and tuning, so it's yet to be determined which stat is best.  For the rest of MoP, Mastery is king and there is no debate.

[Nytemare 2]

Herbalism is for Demo/Afflic. It's not a good profession for Destro.

Skinning is crap because it gives nothing compared to what any of the crafting professions grant you. A bit of crit rating is far worse than an extra 2k intellect proc, for example.

Also dwarf looks set to be the best alliance race in WoD.

 

Unclear why dwarf looks to be best? did I miss something? I know they got 2% bonus crit damage, but sounds like that only good for those classes that base around crit. For a lock would that mean 2% CB damage?

 

And Blood Elves for Horde

 

Also, while yes, 1% crit = 1% CB damage, 1% Mastery does the same and requires less rating, so Crit will not outweigh Mastery.  As for WoD, we're unsure of official ratings and tuning, so it's yet to be determined which stat is best.  For the rest of MoP, Mastery is king and there is no debate.

 

Yes I gem all mastery - well I been using your gear as a reference since I still new into the heroic to get idea on what I want to aim for. Most I knew but Off-hand I been mix about Garrosh/IJ/Thok and which non-tier piece was best. 

 

So when it comes to Haste it not as good as Icy says? I off-spec as demo so it could help there I guess.

 

For race change figure I wait until 6.0 patch hits and everything official to do that, but for profession if I was going to change it, best to do it now so I had time to level it up, and get anything for it. 

 

Right now I little over 10.437 haste due to gear, I read in here that was the sweet spot for embers, and everything else. So if I do take Herb to give it a try, do I reforge around it being up (given me sweet spot only when I can pop it every 2min) or ignore it. Of course I still gemed,gear,etc.. for mastery, but if I reforge around it then that means I can squeeze maybe some more crit out of my gear is all.

 

Zag since your a troll and have a haste Cd like lifeblood would be (but of course yours better) how do you handle it? Do you gear/gem/reforge around it being up or just ignore it?

[Zagam 1,983]

Haste vs Crit argument is null and void.  It's a personal preference with Destruction, so just do what's comfortable.  Either way, you won't be generating a DPS variance because of your stats.

 

Berserking is up for the first 15 seconds and is barely used more than twice a fight.  With Bloodlust at the start, it's wasted but still does something to Immolate.  Later in the fight, it just gives a small buff.  I don't reforge or do anything around that value - it's just a bonus perk.

[Nytemare 2]

Haste vs Crit argument is null and void.  It's a personal preference with Destruction, so just do what's comfortable.  Either way, you won't be generating a DPS variance because of your stats.

 

Berserking is up for the first 15 seconds and is barely used more than twice a fight.  With Bloodlust at the start, it's wasted but still does something to Immolate.  Later in the fight, it just gives a small buff.  I don't reforge or do anything around that value - it's just a bonus perk.

 

What do you mean I will not generate a DPS variance? so you saying regardless of what I do, I not going to lose or gain any new DPS?

 

Ah ok so you just use it when you can, and take the bonus got it.

 

Side note why does BE look to be best for Horde? Tuaren get the same bonus Dwarf get with the 2% bonus damage if that what going to make Dwarf best for ally.

Edited August 27, 2014 by Nytemare

[Janglybits 1]

What do you mean I will not generate a DPS variance? so you saying regardless of what I do, I not going to lose or gain any new DPS?

 

Ah ok so you just use it when you can, and take the bonus got it.

 

Side note why does BE look to be best for Horde? Tuaren get the same bonus Dwarf get with the 2% bonus damage if that what going to make Dwarf best for ally.

Tauren can't be Warlocks :)

[Zilthy 36]

What do you mean I will not generate a DPS variance? so you saying regardless of what I do, I not going to lose or gain any new DPS?

 

Ah ok so you just use it when you can, and take the bonus got it.

 

Side note why does BE look to be best for Horde? Tuaren get the same bonus Dwarf get with the 2% bonus damage if that what going to make Dwarf best for ally.

 

The DPS difference between Crit > Haste, Haste (breakpoint) > Crit > Haste and Haste > Crit is *so* small, you will *never* notice it in your DPS, and you will have no variance because of it.

 

It is less than 0.1% which will amount to be about 400 dps.  Personally, if my dps is so low that I notice 400 dps because of a reforge, I am doing something very, very, very wrong.

 

This is why the debate on haste and crit and breakpoints for Destruction warlocks is pointless.

Edited August 27, 2014 by Zilthy

[Nytemare 2]

Tauren can't be Warlocks

 

So wish they could be. Ah so BE for horde, and Dwarf for ally was directed at being the best race for lock got it.

Edited August 27, 2014 by Nytemare

[Orthios 272]

Unclear why dwarf looks to be best? did I miss something? I know they got 2% bonus crit damage, but sounds like that only good for those classes that base around crit. For a lock would that mean 2% CB damage?

2% crit damage will not give 2% more CB damage due to how CB damage is calculated and how crits work.  CB damage = (2.02 (crit multiplier))*(1+Mastery)*(1+Crit)*(Whatever base ends up getting implemented) vs (2 (crit multiplier))*(1+Mastery)*(1+Crit)*(Base).  The overall gain is 1% CB damage.

Edited August 27, 2014 by Orthios

[Nytemare 2]

2% crit damage will not give 2% more CB damage due to how CB damage is calculated and how crits work.  CB damage = (2.02 (crit multiplier))*(1+Mastery)*(1+Crit)*(Whatever base ends up getting implemented) vs (2 (crit multiplier))*(1+Mastery)*(1+Crit)*(Base).  The overall gain is 1% CB damage.

 

Ah so 1% CB damage is the same thing Worgen have now, so what am I still missing that makes Dwarf in its currently Wod form best ally lock race? There stoneform as always been there, just now can remove the other parts like magic and curses.

 

Or is Dwarf best now because it now gives 1% CB damage increase like Worgen while also given a nice 10% damage reduction cd that Worgen doesn't have?

[Liquidsteel 279]

My brain is melting.

[Orthios 272]

Ah so 1% CB damage is the same thing Worgen have now, so what am I still missing that makes Dwarf in its currently Wod form best ally lock race? There stoneform as always been there, just now can remove the other parts like magic and curses.

 

Or is Dwarf best now because it now gives 1% CB damage increase like Worgen while also given a nice 10% damage reduction cd that Worgen doesn't have?

It will mostly depend on personal preferences.  

 

Take a scenario where you have 25% crit rate (without a racial perk).  This in turn averages a 25% gain in dps, RNG dependent.

With the Worgen perk of +1% crit, this turns into 26% crit, which gives an average of 26% gain.

With the Dwarf perk of +2% crit damage (modifies the crit modifier to 2.02), you get an average of 25% of you attacks critting for 2.02x damage.  This in turn averages out to be 25.5% gain in dps.  In this situation, you would want the Worgen perk.  

 

So, now to find the point at which the two perks give equal bonuses.  Turns out that point is at 50% crit (without racial bonuses).  

Worgens get 51% crit rate which equals 51% dps increase.

Dwarves get 50% crit at 2.02x which is 51% dps increase. 

Both are 1% more than without the bonus.

 

Overall, I would say that Worgens have the advantage until 50% crit, which we likely won't ever see (maybe during the last patch of the expansion when your in BiS, but that's dependent on number tuning).  

[Nytemare 2]

It will mostly depend on personal preferences.  

 

Take a scenario where you have 25% crit rate (without a racial perk).  This in turn averages a 25% gain in dps, RNG dependent.

With the Worgen perk of +1% crit, this turns into 26% crit, which gives an average of 26% gain.

With the Dwarf perk of +2% crit damage (modifies the crit modifier to 2.02), you get an average of 25% of you attacks critting for 2.02x damage.  This in turn averages out to be 25.5% gain in dps.  In this situation, you would want the Worgen perk.  

 

So, now to find the point at which the two perks give equal bonuses.  Turns out that point is at 50% crit (without racial bonuses).  

Worgens get 51% crit rate which equals 51% dps increase.

Dwarves get 50% crit at 2.02x which is 51% dps increase. 

Both are 1% more than without the bonus.

 

Overall, I would say that Worgens have the advantage until 50% crit, which we likely won't ever see (maybe during the last patch of the expansion when your in BiS, but that's dependent on number tuning).  

 

Still leaves the question why in it currently Wod state Dwarf seems to be the best ally lock race, while BE according to Zag going to be horde. Trying to figure out what changes are happen that making the dwarf all sudden looking like the best.

 

If we go off what you said then dwarf is only best if we can reach 50% crit as it equal same perk as worgen while also providing survival cd. Damage Increase + Survival Bonus beats just Damage Increase every time  (if damage increase is equal).

 

I plan to make a Dwarf finally thanks to the new models making them look decent, but wondering why they all sudden looks to be the best ally lock race is all. 

[Orthios 272]

I'll leave it to Liquid to explain his reasoning behind Dwarves being best, but to me it seems that Worgen are from a dps perspective only.  How valuable the survivable cooldown turns out to be can easily sway this in favor of Dwarves before 50% crit.  

[Zagam 1,983]

This is all debated as if playing a certain race has a distinct, measureable difference.  The ONLY reason Trolls are outrageously good in most tiers was because of the 5% bonus to beasts, of which we saw several of.  5% was an absurd number to give to a racial and I'm glad it's fixed.  You're talking about a 1% crit chance or 2% crit damage bonus or some other marginal value that isn't going to make or break anyone.  I've seen current Blood Elves out DPS Trolls - it's largely inconsequential.  Spend the time and energy used deciding on a race to bettering your performance now and in the future.  Races, much like secondary stats, make a VERY small impact on your DPS.  Yes, there is some measureable difference.  Is it as impactful as everyone makes it out to be?  No, it is not.

 

It may, actually, be more helpful for you to pick a class based on how good the gear looks instead of a DPS factor.  The bonuses are small.  Pick the class that has the best jokes, looks the best, flirts the best, or perhaps some other passive bonus most overlook.

[Liquidsteel 279]

• Might of the Mountain is a new racial passive ability that increases Critical Strike bonus damage and healing dealt by 2%.

 

As far as I'm aware, crit damage being increased by 2% actually means 4%, as crits are 200%.

 

The Burning Primal Diamond is an example of this. It offers 3% bonus crit damage, however this results in a 6% increase to Chaos Bolt damage.

 

That is my reasoning for Dwarf.