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Damien

[Archived] Fury Warrior 5.4

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Guest Mayham

Still no reason for gemming STR over CRIT.

What do you mean no reason for gemming STR over CRIT? Of course it's a reason...strength makes things hit harder. The only reason crit has been higher than strength recently is because crit enrages you increasing damage done *and* ENABLING RAGING BLOW. Without raging blow active fury does not have a solid filler. With Single-Minded Fury, the rage generation is smooth (more heroic strike instead of down time) and more importantly Wild Strike can be used more freely with better rage gen. The point is, you don't want to have to gem for crit, you want to gem strength as crit doesn't make all your attacks hit harder, you want crit because Bloodthirst crits and Colossus Smash crits will enrage you. It's all about enrage uptime for fury recently, and the spec is sliding back into strength usage and becoming less dependent on crit, which BTW is good.

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Guest Guest

How about you do your own research aka running sims for statweights? Strength has to be TWICE as good as crit point-for-point before we start gemming for strength again. From the sims i've run, strength is only slightly ahead of crit point-for-point with SMF.

Your logic is also flawed. So what if rage gen is smoother with SMF than TG (and only slightly) when you have to spend rage on low damage-per-rage attacks instead of raging blows? Crit is still king.

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Guest Mayham

"How about you do your own research aka running sims for statweights? Strength has to be TWICE as good as crit point-for-point before we start gemming for strength again. From the sims i've run, strength is only slightly ahead of crit point-for-point with SMF."

You're right! I missed that. I totally forgot that secondary stats are double values. Strength is ahead of crit, but in terms of gemming crit is more valuable. Perfect! Fyi, the second point was more rage regen = enrage uptime becomes less a necessity. But yeah you are correct. Gems should be crit as much as possible. I believe the crit/expertise would be best for matching the meta.

Cheers

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For everyone posting suggestions and comments regarding statistics: please know that we are reading and taking them into account. We're going through a very thorough process of confirming/updating our stats for all of our guides, and Fury Warriors are next up. Thank you.

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Guest Bambooty

In the BiS list SMF weapons and TG weapons are listed at wrong place. SMF weapons are 2h and TG weapons are 1h.

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In the BiS list SMF weapons and TG weapons are listed at wrong place. SMF weapons are 2h and TG weapons are 1h.

Oops. Thanks. Fixing it :)

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Guest Waryat

Have you ran any simulations that u place hard cap hit (26,5%) over mastery in stat weights? I mean it might be better now, in 1st tier of this expansion, since we are some times rage starving, but will the high rage generation - more frequent rotation result in a DPS gain over loosing a few % of increased dmg while enraged?

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Have you ran any simulations that u place hard cap hit (26,5%) over mastery in stat weights? I mean it might be better now, in 1st tier of this expansion, since we are some times rage starving, but will the high rage generation - more frequent rotation result in a DPS gain over loosing a few % of increased dmg while enraged?

Currently, it is optimal the way we list it. We have no doubt that the dynamics of the priority will change as time goes on, almost certainly so in future raiding tiers when stats increase a lot due to new gear. For now, though, our simulations show the 26.5% hit cap to be better than Mastery.

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Guest Waryat

Which trinkets in your opinion will be BiS trinekts for fury warriors for current raiding tier? Relic of Xuen seems to be a no-brainer but 2nd trinket is not that obvious choice. Darkmist Vortex or Lei Shin's Final Orders?

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Which trinkets in your opinion will be BiS trinekts for fury warriors for current raiding tier? Relic of Xuen seems to be a no-brainer but 2nd trinket is not that obvious choice. Darkmist Vortex or Lei Shin's Final Orders?

If you want to believe the more eccentric opinions out there (which are fairly well supported), your BiS trinkets are inv_jewelry_trinket_16.jpgLei Shin's Final Orders and inv_jewelry_trinket_09.jpgCarbonic Carbuncle.

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Guest Waryat

Can anyone provide suitable Simcraft result to compare the trinkets u typed as BiS and another with Lei Shin's Final Orders (heroic, with haste to crit reforge) and relic of Xuen? Sorry but im not that much into theorycrafting to provide those results myself. Ill be grateful.

One more questiom, does those stat weights refer to both SMF and TG? Cheers.

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Can anyone provide suitable Simcraft result to compare the trinkets u typed as BiS and another with Lei Shin's Final Orders (heroic, with haste to crit reforge) and relic of Xuen? Sorry but im not that much into theorycrafting to provide those results myself. Ill be grateful.

One more questiom, does those stat weights refer to both SMF and TG? Cheers.

The stat priorities in the guide apply to both SMF and TG, since they are, currently, the same for both. For the actual weights, we recommend that you put your character into Ask Mr. Robot and click on Optimise and Edit Weights - this will show you the actual stat weights they use for each stat (and then you can go on to put them into something like reforgelite if you want).

Also, you can do the trinket swap on Ask Mr Robot as well, just load your character, or the premade BiS Fury Warrior character, click on the trinket you want to replace in the list of gear on the left, and select the Relic of Xuen. You will notice the score difference that Mr Robot gives between the two sets (look at the score you have before you replace the trinket). They run many calculations and simulations behind the scenes, their numbers aren't just out of nowhere.

I have the Carbonic Carbuncle and just got Lei Shin's Final Orders. My other trinket is the Coren's Cold Chromium Coaster. Obviously I'd reforge the haste to crit, but would it be worth it? A very brief test on a test dummy put it at slightly less dps, but that could be procs or something else. Anyone else have some imput?

Both of those trinkets (Carbonic Carbuncle and Lei Shin's Final Orders) are unquestionably better than Coren's Gold Chromium Coaster. You absolutely should replace it with Lei Shin's Final Orders, and reforge the Haste to Crit :)

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Guest Waryat

Well I am going to try running my own Sims, since Im still not convinced to Carbonic Carbuncle as our 2nd bis trinket. I also have heared that there will be some new trinkets for Valor Pointsis u will be revered/exalted (?) with Klaxxi, don't know if this is true.

Im not a fan of mr Robot, wasn't very happy of my optimization result where the robot suggested to replace crit enchant on back for hit one, while soft capped and I could say a few more things. Anyway, when can we expect a BiS list with all the T14H gear? (Including Terrace of Endless Springs loot). Im really courious of wrist/neck choice of yours.

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Does anyone know if there is a number to shoot for with crit before another stat may become more desirable? With Berserker Rage having a rather short CD, it isn't hard to keep enraged most often. I imagine there must be a magic number but I am too lazy to find it, lol.

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Guest Waryat

Well if u manage to get 45% crit (50% with raid buff) you will have 100% crit chance on Bloodthirst which means u will have 100% enrage uptime. I suppose by the time u achieve that we will be struggling with an end game content so rage generation (due to high MH DPS weapons) won't be issue and 7.5% hit will be enough. Therefore mastery will be our best secondary stat providing us pure DPS boost with every %. Correct me if im wrong.

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Currently I have only like15% or so crit but I imagine the number has to be lower than 45% since enrage comes from other crits as well as using berserker rage to help keep that uptime more constant. Chances are I will never get to 45% crit because once i reach about 30% - 35% I will look to other stats to boost. You are correct that getting up that high would be a guarantee, on paper, but I imagine a lower number should get close enough and somewhere along the lines crit has to have diminishing returns before 45%. With Colossus Smash and Bloodthirst potentially proccing engage perhaps maybe 35% or so could be enough. Who knows, it may be easy to reach 45% and there will be no worry about it.

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Guest Canadianhero

Obviously the Darkmoon trinket is our BiS atm.

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Guest Balaim

The AoE rotation suggested in this article is not optimal in my opinion. A much higher dps can be achieved by (these suggestions ignores Bladestorm, Dragon Roar):

2-4 target situation: stacking meatcleaver to number of targets minus one, without having downtime on CS and BT to procc RB and release the MC stacks. Dump the extra rage with cleave (cause it's off gcd).

For 5+ targets using WW as much as u can, using BT to gain rage and dumping a 3 meat cleaver stack with RB when low on rage. Those situations (with 5+ mobs) are nice to time with cd's such as bloodbath and (ofc) recklessness.

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Guest Melenan

Obviously the Darkmoon trinket is our BiS atm.

Far from it, actually. Lessons of the Darkmaster, Carbonic Carbuncle, Lei Shin's Final Orders (including LFR version), Daelo's Final Words, and even Ghost Iron Dragonling (which could theoretically be BiS in certain gear sets) are all much better than the Darkmoon Relic.

This is because Crit rating, along with Hit and Expertise up to the cap, are worth far more per point than Strength for fury.

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Agreed, but one of the biggest points of contention here for me is the fact that most of the epic trinkets provide Haste and Strength. Is losing strength, for haste and a minimal amount of other stats, really beneficial? I believe it likely is, but I would love to see the math worked out so that I could justify it for myself. The larger issue here is that Blizzard did not take care of warriors this tier. Not only were we hampered by gear more than in the past, but we also were given no trinket made for us. Instead most of the plate drops (especially in MSV) and rings/cloaks/trinkets cater to the Ret Paladins and Frost DKs. Sad, but this is why Carbonic Carbuncle is listed amongst our Heroic BiS.

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The AoE rotation suggested in this article is not optimal in my opinion. A much higher dps can be achieved by (these suggestions ignores Bladestorm, Dragon Roar):

2-4 target situation: stacking meatcleaver to number of targets minus one, without having downtime on CS and BT to procc RB and release the MC stacks. Dump the extra rage with cleave (cause it's off gcd).

For 5+ targets using WW as much as u can, using BT to gain rage and dumping a 3 meat cleaver stack with RB when low on rage. Those situations (with 5+ mobs) are nice to time with cd's such as bloodbath and (ofc) recklessness.

Thank you! Integrating this into the guide :)

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Guest guest

Does racial bonus (e.g. Sword Specialization for humans) count separately for main&off hand? Read does 2H Sword in mainhand debuff targets dodge for off hand 2h axe's attacks?

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