Unholy Death Knight 7.3

[Samuru89 0]

sorry if this like hand-holding here

Im not theorycrafter by any means but just want to get a clarification.

you mention the stat priority is haste > mastery > crit but when i run simcraft its saying i want haste > crit > mastery. is the haste > mastery meant for players who are highly geared? if so, cool ill just follow simcraft. just not 100% sure which i should i be following. i am sitting at 13% crit, 21% haste, and 60% mastery at ilvl 711 with only two piece from HFC.

again, sorry if this is like hand-holding here. >.<

[Tegu 1]

10 minutes ago, Samuru89 said:

sorry if this like hand-holding here

Im not theorycrafter by any means but just want to get a clarification.

you mention the stat priority is haste > mastery > crit but when i run simcraft its saying i want haste > crit > mastery. is the haste > mastery meant for players who are highly geared? if so, cool ill just follow simcraft. just not 100% sure which i should i be following. i am sitting at 13% crit, 21% haste, and 60% mastery at ilvl 711 with only two piece from HFC.

again, sorry if this is like hand-holding here. >.<

No, it's just the Icy Veins staff haven't updated it yet and indeed should be Haste > Critical > Versatility > Mastery for single target and Haste > Critical > Mastery > Versatility for AoE.

[bigtasty1979 0]

all shall serve is simming a few thousand dps higher for me than the other talents.  are the sims not working well with that talents or should i be ok if it is simming higher?

[Tegu 1]

I wouldn't trust sims that much yet and to answer your question i'd say that AWS is worse than Bursting Sores and Ebon Fever. Could be good for leveling if you don't want to go Ebon Fever.

[bigtasty1979 0]

thanks. 

[Guest Greiver]

Here's just a recommendation on a simple but useful macro for pet management as Unholy. Basically what this does is makes one button to use Dark Transformation unless your Ghoul does not exist in which case it will summon your ghoul.

#showtooltip
/cast [nopet] Raise Dead
/stopmacro [nopet]
/cast [target=pet,exists]Dark Transformation

[Guest Snorana]

Hi, just wanted to add my touch and say what I found.

I ran a few simcrafts with today's beta version and it's telling me that single target Unholy Frenzy is in front of Castigator by 4k dps, I also really like UF because since Sudden Doom's proc chance  now works off attack speed and not haste anymore, it increases sudden doom proc chance by 100% leading to a great Val'kyr pull. Also statwise the sims is currently telling me :

Str > Haste > AP > Wdps > Vers ~= Crit > Mastery

1 ; 0.91 ; 0.86; 0.70 ; 0.62 ; 0.59 ; 0.39 for the normalized weights.

Also best single target option on first tier based on the sim is All Will Serve. 

And lastly, in AoE situations mastery doesn t surpass Versatility before 6-7 targets.

Which means going for haste>Versa as main stats maybe, except for intense Mythic+ if packs get huge.

All those numbers are based on the 08/12 simcraft beta version and are made on my lvl 100 toon.

Have a nice day,

Snorana

[Tegu 1]

5 hours ago, Guest Snorana said:

Hi, just wanted to add my touch and say what I found.

I ran a few simcrafts with today's beta version and it's telling me that single target Unholy Frenzy is in front of Castigator by 4k dps, I also really like UF because since Sudden Doom's proc chance  now works off attack speed and not haste anymore, it increases sudden doom proc chance by 100% leading to a great Val'kyr pull. Also statwise the sims is currently telling me :

Str > Haste > AP > Wdps > Vers ~= Crit > Mastery

1 ; 0.91 ; 0.86; 0.70 ; 0.62 ; 0.59 ; 0.39 for the normalized weights.

Also best single target option on first tier based on the sim is All Will Serve. 

And lastly, in AoE situations mastery doesn t surpass Versatility before 6-7 targets.

Which means going for haste>Versa as main stats maybe, except for intense Mythic+ if packs get huge.

All those numbers are based on the 08/12 simcraft beta version and are made on my lvl 100 toon.

Have a nice day,

Snorana

Your stat weights are not correct for pre-patch  also AwS isn't better than Bursting Sores for single target. 

[Guest Veiss Versa]

Question about the Unholy Frenzy/Castigator/Clawing Shadows tier... With the recent nerfs to Clawing Shadows, I can see that Castigator is clearly the best option currently.

However, this raises questions for me regarding the level 110 experience... Do you think that the removal of the legendary ring as a factor, as well as the introduction of Apocalypse as a cooldown will push us into more of a Soul Reaper/Unholy Frenzy setup to make use of all that burst haste? Especially since Castigator itself is non-optimal because it, firstly, doesn't play into our best all-round stat priority (Depending on Crit, which is arguably our third-best stat), and secondly can potentially cause wasted Festering Wounds? It throws a pretty bad wrench into the blackjack game. (FeS once to 6, you will definitely waste wounds on the second hit, or FeS for 2, then maybe crit and get to potentially anywhere between 5 and 8  or even just to 4 more so you have to FeS again?)

Or am I seriously overthinking this and it's not even necessary to worry about potentially over-capping Wounds this much?

[arson94 0]

12 hours ago, Guest Veiss Versa said:

Question about the Unholy Frenzy/Castigator/Clawing Shadows tier... With the recent nerfs to Clawing Shadows, I can see that Castigator is clearly the best option currently.

However, this raises questions for me regarding the level 110 experience... Do you think that the removal of the legendary ring as a factor, as well as the introduction of Apocalypse as a cooldown will push us into more of a Soul Reaper/Unholy Frenzy setup to make use of all that burst haste? Especially since Castigator itself is non-optimal because it, firstly, doesn't play into our best all-round stat priority (Depending on Crit, which is arguably our third-best stat), and secondly can potentially cause wasted Festering Wounds? It throws a pretty bad wrench into the blackjack game. (FeS once to 6, you will definitely waste wounds on the second hit, or FeS for 2, then maybe crit and get to potentially anywhere between 5 and 8  or even just to 4 more so you have to FeS again?)

Or am I seriously overthinking this and it's not even necessary to worry about potentially over-capping Wounds this much?

That's what I've been doing.  FeS with no more than 2 wounds up and SS with no less than 2 wounds up so I didn't waste any.

[Guest Bubbledeath]

Sorry if this has already been said, but it is kind of unclear, to me at least. What would i take as the final talent tree if i dont have the legendary ring? Does it depend on the fight length, so if its less than 3 minutes take Dark Arbiter but if longer take Soul reaper? im sorry if the guide states this but its is kind of unclear to me.

[Tegu 1]

15 hours ago, Guest Veiss Versa said:

Question about the Unholy Frenzy/Castigator/Clawing Shadows tier... With the recent nerfs to Clawing Shadows, I can see that Castigator is clearly the best option currently.

However, this raises questions for me regarding the level 110 experience... Do you think that the removal of the legendary ring as a factor, as well as the introduction of Apocalypse as a cooldown will push us into more of a Soul Reaper/Unholy Frenzy setup to make use of all that burst haste? Especially since Castigator itself is non-optimal because it, firstly, doesn't play into our best all-round stat priority (Depending on Crit, which is arguably our third-best stat), and secondly can potentially cause wasted Festering Wounds? It throws a pretty bad wrench into the blackjack game. (FeS once to 6, you will definitely waste wounds on the second hit, or FeS for 2, then maybe crit and get to potentially anywhere between 5 and 8  or even just to 4 more so you have to FeS again?)

Or am I seriously overthinking this and it's not even necessary to worry about potentially over-capping Wounds this much?

Unholy Frenzy is probably the worst talent right now in that tier and unless they change something with it i expect Castigator / Clawing Shadows to be the talents we play with once again. Regarding the level 100 talents yes Soul Reaper should be pulling ahead of Dark Arbiter at 110 with long fights even though the difference between those 2 talents wasn't that big last raid testing. About the Festering Wounds you can easily avoid over capping them outside of Apocalypse. Capping with Apocalypse isn't a bad thing because of the Artifact Weapon traits that buffs your army.

1 hour ago, Guest Bubbledeath said:

Sorry if this has already been said, but it is kind of unclear, to me at least. What would i take as the final talent tree if i dont have the legendary ring? Does it depend on the fight length, so if its less than 3 minutes take Dark Arbiter but if longer take Soul reaper? im sorry if the guide states this but its is kind of unclear to me.

Right now Dark Arbiter is king simply because the raid encounters doesn't last that long to make Soul Reaper viable.

[Quiks 0]

Hi Tegu just a little question 

how should i scale my uhdk? 

the stats order are crit/haste/mast

18/26/64 or 21/22/64

Edited August 14, 2016 by Quiks

[Tegu 1]

50 minutes ago, Quiks said:

Hi Tegu just a little question 

how should i scale my uhdk? 

the stats order are crit/haste/mast

18/26/64 or 21/22/64

18/26/64

[Guest Hydrun]

Fantastic guide Tegu, was away from the game for 6-ish years so it was nice to get a solid refresher for my UH DK. I do have a question about Bursting Sores however. I've been using your recommended talents (Soul Reaper instead of DA as I do not have the ring) and it has been working well, but I'm surprised to see Festering Wounds as the highest percentage of my damage, about 1% above scourge strike. This has been the case since switching to Castigator after the CS nerf, and I was wondering if I should just default to Bursting Sores instead of Ebon Fever for single target, swapping to Ebon Epidemic for AoE? I know the guide says Sores are better for burst, but both seem to be sustained damage unless you arent in melee with the boss no? Or is Ebon that valuable to default too because of the confirmed damage and passive cleave? 

[Tegu 1]

3 hours ago, Guest Hydrun said:

Fantastic guide Tegu, was away from the game for 6-ish years so it was nice to get a solid refresher for my UH DK. I do have a question about Bursting Sores however. I've been using your recommended talents (Soul Reaper instead of DA as I do not have the ring) and it has been working well, but I'm surprised to see Festering Wounds as the highest percentage of my damage, about 1% above scourge strike. This has been the case since switching to Castigator after the CS nerf, and I was wondering if I should just default to Bursting Sores instead of Ebon Fever for single target, swapping to Ebon Epidemic for AoE? I know the guide says Sores are better for burst, but both seem to be sustained damage unless you arent in melee with the boss no? Or is Ebon that valuable to default too because of the confirmed damage and passive cleave? 

Yes you should go with Bursting Sores and Castigator for Single Target and Ebon Fever for AoE.

[Guest zouma]

thanks for your guide. Tegu, just a littl question. (i can't speak english well. sorry)

single target talent :  BS - PP - Casti or CS - SB - @ - SI or IC - SR (i don't have a legend ring)

AoE : EF - Ep - Casti or CS - SB - @ - SI - Defile

is it best?

and why don't you use BF? 

[Guest zouma]

2 hours ago, Guest zouma said:

thanks for your guide. Tegu, just a littl question. (i can't speak english well. sorry)

single target talent :  BS - PP - Casti or CS - SB - @ - SI or IC - SR (i don't have a legend ring)

AoE : EF - Ep - Casti or CS - SB - @ - SI - Defile

is it best?

and why don't you use BF? 

 

and why don't you use BF?*

BF is misprint. it is UF(Unholy Frenzy)

[Tegu 1]

7 hours ago, Guest zouma said:

thanks for your guide. Tegu, just a littl question. (i can't speak english well. sorry)

single target talent :  BS - PP - Casti or CS - SB - @ - SI or IC - SR (i don't have a legend ring)

AoE : EF - Ep - Casti or CS - SB - @ - SI - Defile

is it best?

and why don't you use BF? 

BS - PP for long duration fights ( BRW for short ones 2,3 minutes top ) - Castigator - SB - SI ( for 1:30 + fights ) - IC ( for short fights ) - Dark Arbiter is king  otherwise Soul reaper ( depending on your gear and kill times )

AoE - EF - Epidemic - Castigator - SB - SI for long fights, IC short - Dark Arbiter or Soul reaper, Defile is dead.

Unholy frenzy is shit just boosts your melee attacks which ain't that good compared to Castigator. 

[Guest Therrom]

One question, why use Festering Strike to keep Festering Wound at max stacks? 

It's not a DoT, and bursting a wound at 1 stack does exactly  the same damage as bursting a wound at 8. So shouldn't we be bursting them as fast as possible instead of stacking them to 8? Possibly 2 or 3 for the bursting two at once talent, or the pet bursting one.

The only possible reason I can see is for an add that dies quickly, to get the exploding damage when it dies. But for a single target boss, the damage after it dies doesn't matter.

[Tegu 1]

1 hour ago, Guest Therrom said:

One question, why use Festering Strike to keep Festering Wound at max stacks? 

It's not a DoT, and bursting a wound at 1 stack does exactly  the same damage as bursting a wound at 8. So shouldn't we be bursting them as fast as possible instead of stacking them to 8? Possibly 2 or 3 for the bursting two at once talent, or the pet bursting one.

The only possible reason I can see is for an add that dies quickly, to get the exploding damage when it dies. But for a single target boss, the damage after it dies doesn't matter.

Can you link me the part saying that you should go for 8 stacks ? You just don't want to overcap them, there's nothing more into it.

[Guest Therrom]

Quote

4. Cast  Festering Strike.

This applies 2-4 stacks of the  Festering Wound debuff, which caps at 8 stacks. Do not use Festering Strike if you are at maximum stacks, and ideally avoid wasting any potential stacks (so try not to cast it when you have 5 or more stacks).

5. Cast  Scourge Strike (or  Clawing Shadows, if you have taken this talent).

This consumes 1 stack of  Festering Wound, so only use it if the target has at least 1 st

 

I took that as a priority, meaning "cast Festering Strike unless you cap, and only then cast Scourge Strike". I'm sorry if that's not what you meant, but that is what I took it for.

So is there a number of stacks I should aim for, or is any number >0 good?

[Tegu 1]

9 minutes ago, Guest Therrom said:

I took that as a priority, meaning "cast Festering Strike unless you cap, and only then cast Scourge Strike". I'm sorry if that's not what you meant, but that is what I took it for.

So is there a number of stacks I should aim for, or is any number >0 good?

There's not really a set in stone number since the amount of Festering Wounds is random especially with Castigator basically try avoiding over capping it for example don't FS if you are at 6 stacks. Things will change when Apocalypse is in the game.

[arson94 0]

It doesn't proc all the time, but I have had quite a few times FeS give me 4 wounds and it also crit causing Castigator to give me 2 more for a total of 6 wounds in a single FeS.  And a fair amount of the time I burst 2 wounds at a time.  So I FeS with 2 or less wounds and SS with 2 or more wounds.  However, it can get tedious here and there as sometimes you just alternate FeS and SS several times over.

 

I do have one question though.  Does FeS refresh the duration of already existing wounds?  It seems like it does to me but I wasn't sure.

[Tegu 1]

14 minutes ago, arson94 said:

It doesn't proc all the time, but I have had quite a few times FeS give me 4 wounds and it also crit causing Castigator to give me 2 more for a total of 6 wounds in a single FeS.  And a fair amount of the time I burst 2 wounds at a time.  So I FeS with 2 or less wounds and SS with 2 or more wounds.  However, it can get tedious here and there as sometimes you just alternate FeS and SS several times over.

 

I do have one question though.  Does FeS refresh the duration of already existing wounds?  It seems like it does to me but I wasn't sure.

It is what it is, you can't really control random abilities.

And yes Festering Strike refreshes the duration of FW.