5.4 Destruction Tips and Quirks

[Ilion 8]

Why would you waste Backdraft*** stacks in your opener? You have plenty of time to get two chaos bolts off because you have your meta gem proc (30% like Backdraft would provide) and possibly Heroism and/or Berserking if you're Troll.

 

No bueno.

 

 

I'd "waste" stacks of Backdraft anyday if it let me cast another buffed CB.

[Nytemare 2]

If youre destro only, I would use WF Helm, until you can throw together a 4 piece.  The secondary stats are better, and theres about 300 more intellect on it as well.  2 piece is amazing for Affliction, but not so much destro.  Destro shines with the 4pc.  If you go Affi as off-spec...use both.  Tier for affi, and WF for destro.

 

Well I am destro only do have off spec in demo which I have played and could go affliction just got to get them down to being good. Going to take Thok on tonight should I try for the T Helm if it drops or pass on it. In the end for Destro I had plan to get T shoulders, gloves(got), chest, and Legs and use WF helm which now have. 

[dotscom 0]

I have a question for those with an affliction offspec. What are you doing reforge wise? Are you using different reforges per spec change or are you using one that accommodates both specs? 

[Ilion 8]

I have a question for those with an affliction offspec. What are you doing reforge wise? Are you using different reforges per spec change or are you using one that accommodates both specs? 

 

I get to 9778 haste for the Agony Tick

[Kazistrasz 216]

I have a question for those with an affliction offspec. What are you doing reforge wise? Are you using different reforges per spec change or are you using one that accommodates both specs? 

 

Depends on the level you're playing at. If you're just doing normals and such, a reforge that works for both specs you're playing is fine. Honestly, my Destro reforge still lets me do numbers I find acceptable as Affliction. When you're raiding hardcore and doing heroics progression, most people generally reforge for the spec they're using on the progression fight.

 

You can use any spec's reforge for any other spec and do quite respectable numbers. Your reforge and stat priorities are almost none of your damage. Your difference from week to week and fight to fight will be gear upgrades and most of all how well you actually play. It's hardly worth worrying about reforge as DPS.

[JvChequer 43]

I reforge every time I change to affli or destro, spend about 150g for reforging but it's not a big deal.

[Wolland 1]

I disagree.  I get about 4 CB's off in my opener.  Occasionally I'll even luck out and get Toxic Power to proc back to back.  I pretty much always use my 2nd and 3rd Conflag to push out more CB's, because with all those buffs that's the best damage you're going to get.

 

How do you manage to get 4 CB's off in your opener? I stuggle to get 2, just like everyone else, unless your opener lasts 5 minutes or something 

I would have thought a 3rd conflag is already past the opening sequence.

Edited October 31, 2013 by Wolland

[Narga 0]

How do you manage to get 4 CB's off in your opener? I stuggle to get 2, just like everyone else, unless your opener lasts 5 minutes or something

This. I can easily get off 3 CB's, but 4? Does everything you do crit, so you get double embers from it? :P

[Hurtlocker 11]

I have a question for those with an affliction offspec. What are you doing reforge wise? Are you using different reforges per spec change or are you using one that accommodates both specs? 

 

I go for the 9778 haste BP for aff as well, but I MS affliction on most fights.  The few that I use destro for (Spoils, Garrosh and Galakras) I don't reforge.  The 4k or so extra crit is not that noticeable to me.

[Wolland 1]

I go for the 9778 haste BP for aff as well, but I MS affliction on most fights.  The few that I use destro for (Spoils, Garrosh and Galakras) I don't reforge.  The 4k or so extra crit is not that noticeable to me.

 

Same, however I play Destro as MS, I only go Affli on Protectors, Shaman, and Thok.

We could push the 10124 threshold later on with higher ilvls, 56-something?

[Ilion 8]

Same, however I play Destro as MS, I only go Affli on Protectors, Shaman, and Thok.

We could push the 10124 threshold later on with higher ilvls, 56-something?

 

 

I wouldn't do it (Well, I don't) if you are not going to multidot immo.

[Orei 2]

You can get 4 in with lucky crits and using conflag charges on cb. I usually use all my charges on incin off the bat to fill my first ember. Full buffs, procs, and 4 piece crit bonus for the first two cbs :3

[Rakupenda 15]

How do you manage to get 4 CB's off in your opener? I stuggle to get 2, just like everyone else, unless your opener lasts 5 minutes or something 

I would have thought a 3rd conflag is already past the opening sequence.

 

This. I can easily get off 3 CB's, but 4? Does everything you do crit, so you get double embers from it?

Likewise...how do you manage to generate three embers in 10 seconds (BBOY/KTT) AND get four Chaos bolts off?

 

Thinking about even the first 20 seconds (PBI)...6-10 seconds casting the four Chaos Bolts + you've gotta generate three embers...and you said you're using your backdrafts on the Chaos Bolts instead of quicker Incinerates for more embers.

So just to get 30 ember bits in 20 seconds single target, what would it take:

Immolate can generate 11 if it Crits every time (Hero + Meta & 7800 haste). So the other 19 from Incinerate/Conflag crits/RoF. Assuming the three Conflag's crit (two initial and one after 15 sec CD) that's three embers, and assume RoF generates 2 if you keep it up for meta haste procs, 14 embers left. If you Crit every time with Incinerate that would take 7 casts of Critting Incinerates.

 

Three globals for Conflag and they crit (3 sec), Two for RoF (2 sec), Two cast times for Critting Immolates (2 sec, refreshed at some point), and 7 Incinerate Crits with 1 second casts with Heroism? (9 seconds) and Four Chaos Bolts with lots o' haste (6 seconds, heroism?+meta+2 w/ Backdraft) =~ 22 seconds

 

It may be possible with heroism...assuming everything crits.

 

Unless you're talking for a multi-target fight like Guardians,Paragons, or Garrosh?

[Zagam 1,983]

People are confusing 'opener' with 'start of the fight.'  Your "opener" is a special rotation you do with all procs live that differs from a normal rotation.  Once you go back to your Conflag on CD, keep Immo up, and use CB with buffs, you've left your "opener" and joined your "rotation." 

 

There is no 20 second "opener."  There is a 10 second "opener" and nothing after that except a normal rotation that will still have an Intellect bonus from PBI.  No one gets 4 CBs off in 10 seconds.  No one.  Ever.  It's impossible.

[Omaric 246]

How do you manage to get 4 CB's off in your opener? I stuggle to get 2, just like everyone else, unless your opener lasts 5 minutes or something 

I would have thought a 3rd conflag is already past the opening sequence.

 

Why does everyone assume the opener is the first 10 seconds?  Your opener is the window in which you have a ton of buffs up, including potion.  I have buffs that go over the 10 second window, as do most of you.  For me, my opener ends when my first DS ends.  I can easily fit 4 CB's in there, sometimes 5 depending on the fight.

 

 

People are confusing 'opener' with 'start of the fight.'  Your "opener" is a special rotation you do with all procs live that differs from a normal rotation.  Once you go back to your Conflag on CD, keep Immo up, and use CB with buffs, you've left your "opener" and joined your "rotation." 

 

There is no 20 second "opener."  There is a 10 second "opener" and nothing after that except a normal rotation that will still have an Intellect bonus from PBI.  No one gets 4 CBs off in 10 seconds.  No one.  Ever.  It's impossible.

 

When I'm still using Conflag in my first 20 seconds to get off as many CB's as possible, I don't consider that my rotation, because I don't normally do that.

[Kazistrasz 216]

I'm with Omaric. I don't agree with 10 seconds.

 

Yes, the opener is the particular way you start a fight in order to take advantage of the only time in the fight where you will have all of your buffs and procs. This means DS, PBI, KTT, Potion, Hero, Jade Spirit, Tempus Repit, and possibly Lightweave and/or Synapse Springs if you have the professions for them. Oh, and Skull Banner if you have warriors.

 

I totally agree with the opener being 20 seconds. Potion + Hero + Immo + PBI are all up for 20 seconds. The first ten seconds might be stronger with KTT and Banner and Repit, but you're still going to be stronger than any other part of the fight with the rest up. That 10 seconds also isn't precisely 10 seconds. With all of those RPPM mechanics, some may proc back-to-back, or one or two may not proc on your very first spell. If you have a warrior and they're good, they're not popping skull banner on their very first button, because they're going to take 2-3 seconds to get rage before they drop it and unload.

 

Even still, I don't see 4 CBs in 20 seconds unless you have mad RNG. I don't think it's consistently possible just because of how much time it takes to cast them and how many spells it takes to generate 30 emberbits.

[Omaric 246]

Maybe I'm lucky and maybe I'm not, but if I don't get 4 CB's in my first 20 seconds I did it wrong.  I do it a lot.  :D

[Zagam 1,983]

You guys have some weird openers.  After my Toxic Blood wears off and my 2nd CB is off, I'm back to recharging Embers for another proc.  I'll fire another CB before PBI's buff wears off, but I go right into my rotation.  Perhaps this is why people are having a difficult time hitting the 800k opener?

 

Tempus Repit = 10 seconds (only Haste)

Jade Spirit = 15 seconds

Dark Soul = 20 seconds

Potion = 25 seconds

KTT = 10 seconds

PBI = 20 seconds

BBoY = 10 seconds

Lightweave = 15 seconds

Synapse Springs = 10 seconds

Berserking = 10 seconds

Blood Fury = 15 seconds

 

After all that stuff wears off after 10ish seconds, you should be doing your normal rotation.  You might consume Backdraft in first 10 seconds to get a CB off with procs, but if you're doing that after 10 seconds, you're making a critical mistake.  Your NORMAL rotation involves using Chaos Bolt with procs live, so you all are technically doing your normal rotation but trying to get Chaos Bolts going because you have procs.  The opener should be ONLY 10 seconds in that you should be Conflagrating twice in a row (never happens again), using Immolate once, using Incinerate 4x and then using 2 Chaos Bolts.  That is your 10 second opener (adjust one Incinerate off if your Haste sucks).  After that, you all should be doing your normal rotation.

[Hurtlocker 11]

I get 12 Chaos bolts out in my opener, but it lasts 2 and a half minutes.

[Omaric 246]

You guys have some weird openers.  After my Toxic Blood wears off and my 2nd CB is off, I'm back to recharging Embers for another proc.  I'll fire another CB before PBI's buff wears off, but I go right into my rotation.  Perhaps this is why people are having a difficult time hitting the 800k opener?

 

o_O

 

800k is on the low end for me.

[Zagam 1,983]

Single target?  On Thok last night, I kept opening around 750-800k consistently in first 15 seconds with one of his interrupts.  I used to spike higher with BBoY, but my sustained is more important to me, hence PBI and KTT.

[Omaric 246]

Single target?  On Thok last night, I kept opening around 750-800k consistently in first 15 seconds with one of his interrupts.  I used to spike higher with BBoY, but my sustained is more important to me, hence PBI and KTT.

 

I opened for about 1.2 million on Immerseus Tuesday.

 

877k on Thok last week.

 

1.23, 1.21 and 800k on our Iron Jugs attempts last week.

[Zagam 1,983]

But did you sustain?  And it is dependent on trinkets.  Also, you're in a 25 man.  More skullbanners, Stormlash, etc. 

[Omaric 246]

We're talking about openers right?

 

I don't think my sustain is bad, I generally rank when I'm doing well.  But yes, if it makes you feel better, we have 2 warriors that may or may not be using Skull Banner, inflating my DPS by 400k...... or something...... yeah......

 

Skull banner shows up in "buffs gained" right?  Can't seem to find it.

[Zagam 1,983]

Our raid comp:

 

Warlock

Hunter x2

Elemental Shaman

Rogue

Prot Paladin

BM Monk

Disc Priest

Resto Druid

Resto Shaman

 

We don't have a warrior anymore, so my opener will always be 20% less without Skull Banner.  I only receive tricks after the Rogue's first use to get aggro on the tank.  Don't underestimate the bump you get from 10 to 25 man in terms of DPS and CD stacking.  Ask Zanzal...she moved from 10 to 25 and saw her DPS go up over 100k in the opener with shitty lag.